WL TOYS 144001 / 124018 / 124019 BRUSHLESS 2838 UPGRADE EASY NO CUT OPTION

WL TOys 144001 / 124018 / 124019 Brushless 2838 upgrade Easy No cut option

17/7/2020

Recently I upgraded to brushless power in the WL Toys 144001 as you can see in the below article which is also relevant to the new WL Toys 124018 and 124019:

WL TOYS 144001: ULTIMATE BRUSHLESS UPGRADE GUIDE

Performance is so much better than stock and battery life has increased by over 50%. I much prefer this smaller brushless that the larger 3650 size that are usually limited to on road and speed runs. The install is fairly straightforward but you need to slot the motor mount to set the mesh on the smaller 17t pinion gear and this can be tricky. Good news though, I've found a workaround where no machining nor tricky gear mesh setting is required.

The 144001 uses a 0.7 modulus gear pitch and is very rare for pinions. We are typically limited to the very large stock 27t pinion (way too big for this application) or the 17t pinion from the WL Toys A959 / A969. The 17t pinion offers an excellent ratio for the 2838 and 2845 motors but you need to mod the motor plate as mentioned in my original brushless upgrade article.

Good news though, I've found that using the stock 380 motor mounts on the motor plate you can use a 15t pinion gear. Up until recently these have been impossible to find but I've done a LOT of testing and have found three options for you.

Stock 540/550 mounted motor

380/390 mounted (brushless) motor. See how it is closer to where the spur gear mound so requires the smaller pinion. Update: the 380 motor mounts need to be drilled out from 2.5mm to 3.0mm on the newer mounts

See how much smaller the 15t pinion is compared to the stock 27t

Option 1: 15t from Hobbyking
Hobbyking still have some old stock of a 15t 0.7m pinion that we used on certain helis but it is not a bolt on option - as it has an oversize 5.0mm bore. Because of this you need a 5mm to 3.2mm reducer which is available here. You may also need to file down the grub screw a little if it fouls on the mount. Please note this may now be out of stock depending on warehouse

Hobbyking™ 0.7M Hardened Steel Helicopter Pinion Gear 5mm Shaft - 15T

HOBBYWING Motor Axle 3.17mm To 5mm Change-over Shaft Adapter

Adaptor fits nicely with the Hobbyking pinion

The larger bore means the pinion collar is larger. It fits but the grub screw needs reducing in length just a little.

Option 2: 15t from Aliexpress 2.3mm bore
This pinion is a nice fit but you will need to increase the bore of the pinion from 2.3mm to 3.2mm. This can be done easily with the appropriate drill bit such as this cheap 3.2mm bit option here. The other option is to run a motor with a 2.3mm shaft like the one below. If the above link isn't working try this link for 15t pinion

0.7m 15t pinion gear from Aliexpress with 2.3mm shaft bore or try this link for 15t pinion

You'll need to drill like this, see my original brushless upgrade article for a more in-depth guide.

Racerstar 2440 Motor Brushless Waterproof Sensorless 6080 /4600 /4000KV
This motor is a little smaller but should still power the 144001 fine albeit with a little less torque and top end. I prefer the 2838 but this has a 2.3mm shaft and mean you won't need to drill out the pinion

This is what it looks like in the car and what I am running presently. Virgin motor mount with no slotting!

Option 3: 15t from Aliexpress 3.2mm bore
This option will bolt up directly and requires no modification whatsoever. They are a little more expensive because I think they are a specialist item but no mods are needed for this whatsoever. Make sure you choose 15t and 3.17mm

Update: Although the pitch is correct this pinion is too long as reported by a user. Unfortunately mine was lost in the post before I could confirm. I'll work with this supplier to see if they can make a bolt on option but at present I would recommend the above 15t gear and drill out the shaft.

This should be the minimum work option but is the most expensive. I've ordered one to try but have not yet received. Will report back here once I have confirmed it is working as expected. Update, see above note.

Performance
Final mesh is just a little tighter than I'd like (although 14t is too loose after extensive testing). It does settle down after less than half a pack and I can now feel the the backlash is spot on. Understandably top speed is a little down on where the 17t was but still faster than the stock motor. acceleration is bonkers and due to the relatively low load on the motor battery life is crazy, even on the stock 2s lipo.

Given this is little under-geared, it really opens up the opportunity to run 3s where this should be capable of fairly ludicrous off-road speed. I want to do some more testing in this space around durability so please watch this space and I'll update later on with my experiences. Update: I'd recommend sticking this 2s - although I've not burnt out running on 3s there seems to be a 10-20% failure rate with extended running. The shorter gearing also allows the use of slightly larger wheels such as the excellent P6973 wheels and tyres I detailed in this wheel upgrade guide.

Final recommendations
Although the 17t pinion is probably more suitable for the 2838 4500kv motor I'm running, it takes a lot of work and fiddling to install. Using the one of the 15t gear options I've recommended above will make it a little slower but the install is so much cleaner and probably more robust in the long run. It also makes it more viable for a 3s battery upgrade for some serious power. All in all I'd recommend this over the 17t as per my first brushless upgrade article not because of the out and out performance but because of ease and long term durability.

More power? Yep. More efficient? Yep. Longer life? Yep. Lastly, check out the difference in weight...

Summary of the full recommended parts list to upgrade the WL TOys 144001 from stock brushed to 2838 brushless:

$28 Brushless 2838 motor / 35A esc combo 4500kv I like this size and KV rating. It offers the balance of power, efficiency and weight savings that I think are ideal

$9 PDI-1181MG digital metal gear servo. This servo fits exactly with no mods required. If this is out of stock try the Emax ES3054 which is also a direct fit

$76 Flysky FS-GT5. An outstanding transmitter and reciever, full review here. If this is too expensive and you don't need a gyro in the receiver consider the$30 Flysky FS-GT2E

$5 WL Toys 144001 spare motor mount. Please trust me and buy this part rather than trying to reuse the one in your car. They are impossible to remove without damaging something

0.7m 15t pinion gear. This will need drilling out to 3.2mm but that is easier than modding the motor mount or try this link for 15t pinion

3.2mm hardened drill bit for drilling out pinon gear This bit makes short work of boring out the pinion if required

Thanks for reading, if you found this article useful please feel free to like or share, the facebook links below directly link/like this article. Links are affiliated and help me buy the bits I need to produce this type of content. If you are looking for RC cars, quads or parts check out my coupons and discounts page which I keep updated with only the RC cars, parts and quads I like at a proper discount

Thanks for checking out my article and please let me know on my facebook page or in the 144001 group if it worked out for you. I've created a reference page below for all of the 144001 articles I've published here:
144001 UPGRADES - EVERY ONE OF MY GUIDES HERE.

131 Comments

Thomas B.

7/8/2020 08:43:06 am

Thanks again for the awesome guide! I’ve just upgraded mine using your guide. As I had just received the AliExpress 15t pionion, I have used that one. I used a cheap handsaw (metal) to shorten the pinion about 2mm. As the cut surface is in no way critical, that seemed fairly safe. Tomorrow I’ll give it a test run. Side note; The finishing on the pinion teeth seems fairly rough, lets hope it doesn’t chew through the spur gear!

Quadify RC

7/8/2020 08:54:31 am

Hey Thomas

Yes I've only just found out my no mod pinion is actually not no mod and have updated the article but this doesn't help you much. My 3 on the way have been lost somewhere so unfortunately I don't have first hand experience.

My recommendation now is to get the 15t gear that requires drilling, this seems to be the path of least resistance.

Also you are right about the cut surface, as long as this doesn't touch the spur it should be fine. Best of luck!

18/9/2020 05:15:40 am

So after a few weeks running the option 3 pinion seems to hold up well. Given how easy and fast the hacksaw cut was, I’d actually argue this is as good an option as the others in the article!

Happy ?

11/11/2021 05:47:02 am

So if I choose to set up surpass 2440kk motor can I use the stock pinion and mount if not a959 17t pinion from banggood? Or should I do something else?
Thank you

Valle link

26/3/2021 01:39:24 am

I’m pretty sure the LC Racing motor mount works with the existing system. It uses the same size plug that holds down the main bearing and plush it already has a sliding feature.

26/3/2021 10:35:28 am

Unfortunately the holes don't align and the bearing housing is slighly offset. An Italian member on the facebook group has custom CNC'd his own and sells a limited number.

Bjorn K

21/9/2021 08:06:12 am

thanks for the instructions.
the no cut option worked great, runs like hell.
thanks..

the rebuild is my doughters car a 124019.
now i am getting trouble. when running offtrack with big tires
87 mm on the 15 pinion. 2838 and 4500 kv.
it heats up , esc shuts down and motor is hot to.

want to try something bigger .
this wont do a wheely
something like a 3650 with 3100 kv and a 60 amp esc if i cant fitt it. sould i runn stock pinion or the 15. have to take measurements.

greats . no speed runs just a hell of a bash .
sugestions would be great..

22/9/2021 12:53:57 pm

Hi Bjorn, running a big set of wheels like that changes the effective gearing a lot. I'd recommend dropping down the kv to around 3800, stock with the 2838 or 2845

Bjorn Kup

12/10/2021 11:54:29 pm

Thanks for the reaction.

i had a new combo orderd befor i had seen youre reaction.

i now had orderd a 3650 with 2300 kv. with 60 amp esc.

a update that cant runn those bigger tires either gets hot to.
its the bigger pinion the normal one whats to much for it.

Think ill try 2845 with around 2800 kv and small 15 pinion.

learing every day something new.

even telling the kids on a big jard that there is one light in center dont crash into that...

lasted around 20 min befor they did ;-)

greats

is it posible to get a 124019 to wheely?
or only on 3 s?

cheers

Nocs

12/4/2022 04:54:56 pm

I use a 2845 3800kv motor with 90mm wheels, the MT ones, and the 15t pinion with a hobbywing 120 esc. It runs perfectly with no overheating and pretty fast off Road too. When using onroad tyres (65mm) its slower, but has lots of Torque. Im very Happy with It.

raul d delgadillo

8/8/2020 04:40:20 am

Awesome guide. I'm ordering parts and following this, thank you.

I can't decide between a 2838 and 2845. I don't know what to expect between the two. I wanna go fast and stupid while having decent run time. Would you happen to know what difference in speed/torque/runtime between the two?

8/8/2020 09:51:07 pm

Hey Raul

Thanks man. Probably not a huge difference in practice, I chose the 2838 because there is lots of room and cooling would be more simple. In theory a 2845 should offer more torque (and more current/heat) but in reality they'd be similar. Runtime would be a little less than the 2838 on the same battery but still better than the stock motor.

chris vallone

2/10/2020 02:43:45 pm

what KV would you get for the 2845?

2/10/2020 03:21:33 pm

my bad, what kv for the 2440 motor with 2.3mm shaft?

2/10/2020 03:47:08 pm

Hey Chris

Probably the 4600kv. I'd be very curious to see how this one performs

Eric

18/8/2020 03:38:09 am

Hey Quadify!

First off, amazing site! You made owning and working on my 144001 so much easier!

I am going to be doing the brushless upgrade, but I just had a super noob question. Why is it that the stock 27t pinion is too big for the new setup? What is the issue with a larger pinion?

18/8/2020 09:08:20 am

Hey Eric thanks for the kind feedback, I really enjoy helping people like yourself and getting people hooked. The stock motor is a high wind 550 which puts out a huge amount of low rpm grunt in a car this size so the manufacturer made the gearing tall to get a big top end out of it and brag about top speed. Practically every replacement brushless motor has a lot more speed but a lot less torque at low rpm. Changing the gearing allows us to take advantage of the characteristics of these motors which are superior in every other way.

Later on I might try find a very low kV brushless motor and see if I can get away with stock gearing but I believe the gearing change is the best current solution.

18/8/2020 09:58:17 am

Hey again Quadify....

Thanks so much for taking the time to reply/explain - I completely understand now, I was unaware of that low end torque difference in the brushed/brushless.

My only real experience with RC before this is a cheap MN99s Crawler from Banggood that got my hooked, and all i had done was replace the ESC/Transmitter/Receiver to a better one.

Your site got me to purchase the 144001 which I have had a couple weeks now, I did the camber/toe adjustments right away along with fixing the overfilled shocks - though I still have to pack the diffs with grease and really should get on that before it's too late...

And now it's turning into a full blown tinkering addiction...

I ordered the Brushless motor/ESC combo you recommended along with the servo - though I went with a DumboRC X6/X6FG for transmitter/receiver as they are cheap and still have decent Gyro from what I read... (Quick noob question again, is the advantage of the FlySky FS-GT5 that you can get more receivers and use the same transmitter on multiple vehicles?) Too bad the servo shipping is delayed til september. Oh and of course got the 15t pinion that I will bore out.

Then... this morning while writing my earlier comment I came across your SG1602 article.... and may also have a HBX 16889 on its way...

Joe M.

17/10/2021 02:18:28 am

Hey guys, I know im a bit late to the party but wanted to chime in on this as i have recently picked up one of these 144001's. I just completed a brushless upgrade on the car along with upgrading to steel spur and pinion (stock gearing). The motor/esc combo was a cheapy from amazon(goolrc) 3900kv with 60 amp esc. It coggs like crazy...until you get it going...then its a rocket. The motor size is 3650. I stayed with that size due to the limitations of the stock mount. I recently contacted Castle Creations for a recommendation...they recommended their new copperhead 10 esc(2s to 4s compatible) and 1406 2850kv motor combo due primarilly to the tall gears. The tech said i should see approx. 65 mph on 3s. Also, its a sensored motor and esc so no cogging. Ive yet to install but am hopeful this will be the cure without major surgery. Great site. I hope this helps

David

25/8/2020 08:37:38 am

I recently picked up my own 144001 and I am so glad that I found your blog. Thank you so much for all of the great info on your site, for an adult RC noob like me, it is true gold! Unfortunately, I had already ordered a 3650 brushless motor/60a esc combo based on youtube videos but now I am wishing I had gone with a smaller setup because I will be mostly running off road and in my backyard. Please forgive my dumb question, but is there anything I need to do if I go with option 1? Seems like I just need that 15t hobbyking pinion and the adapter. Do I need to cut or modify any of the parts to have for success? Thanks in advance!!

8/9/2020 10:40:32 am

Argh sorry I missed your comment, my notification system is a bit hit and miss. Thanks for the kind feedback. Option 2 is my strongest recommendation but does require increasing the pinion bore from 2.3mm to 3.2mm (1/8"). I used a vice and hand drill but a drill press if preferable. If you can get an engineering shop to do it that would be best. Beyond that I think I trimmed the plastic gear cowl just a little but considering the alternatives like slotting the motor mount this was much easier. Best of luck!

bjorn

30/10/2021 09:12:28 am

JOE M

how is that sensord combo going.
curious how that works. and if the car can handle that much power.

the cogging hard not funny.

please tell me how it preforms on 2 s .

greatz

8/9/2020 09:09:46 am

Really appreciate you taking the time to put this together. I just ordered two 14401's and came across the below two sources for pinion gears while browsing around. Would either of these work?

https://www.nitrorcx.com/25p-l6080.html

https://www.rcmart.com/lc-racing-lc-racing-17t-18t-19t-motor-gear-set-for-emb-1-emb-sc-emb-wrc-emb-mt-emb-dt-l6032-00061931

Thanks again.

8/9/2020 10:42:17 am

Thanks J! Unfortunately the 144001 has a super uncommon gear pitch and those ones will not work. In a LOT of searching, the ones above are the ONLY 15t options you have. My other brushless article has the link to the 17t one that fits but that requires the motor mount to be modded.

Jordi

11/9/2020 02:46:37 am

Hi! Awesome guide, ordered the parts but still trying to see for better options regarding pinion gear.
How about this 17t 3.175mm pinion from AliExpress?
https://a.aliexpress.com/_BSkHBO

11/9/2020 09:04:02 am

Hey Jordi

They are 0.6 mod and unfortunately we need 0.7mod. 0.7mod are REEEEALLY hard to find and I've listed all the options I've seen in this article after a lot of searching.

11/9/2020 08:12:44 pm

Hi, alright, thanks alot! Gonna have to drill a hole then, hope my steady aim + a hand drill will do the job since I don't know anyone with a drill press!

13/9/2020 04:43:58 pm

Bought the hobbyking pinion and am having a difficult time finding the right screw size to fit the inner two motor mount holes. They seem to be smaller than the ones used w/ the original motor.

13/9/2020 09:54:38 pm

Thanks for reminding me. I had one motor mount like this - needed to enlarge the hole with a 3.0mm drill bit

Nic c

14/9/2020 02:59:04 pm

Hello, is this the same pinion gear you reference?

The m0.7 5mm

GDS Racing 32P Steel Pinion Gear for 1/8"(3.175mm) and 5mm Shaft RC Model (15T) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07VVHDLPX/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_hWTxFbPEVXBZ1

14/9/2020 03:01:09 pm

Unfortunately no, that is 32p (pitch) which is much coarser and typically used on 1/8 scale

Nic C

15/9/2020 02:15:12 am

Ah, thank you (sorry, posted this on the FB group too).
Is there any other source that you can find which has the correct one?
I am searching but don't know 100% what I am looking for.

15/9/2020 05:14:04 am

A bit of trial and error here but I think I have found the one.

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/hobbykingtm-0-7m-hardened-steel-helicopter-pinion-gear-5mm-shaft-15t.html

That's the one, correct?

15/9/2020 05:31:21 am

Need to make sure the shaft diameter is correct for whatever motor you are using. That one is 5mm, your shaft on the motor needs to be 5mm.

Or you reduce the shaft by using a sleeve. I suppose you could ghetto it up and wrap the shaft in some shim stock and then drill a new set screw hole through it.

15/9/2020 08:31:15 am

Thanks Raul, okay, it's becoming clearer to me now.

Phantom1

16/9/2020 10:12:08 pm

Very detailed article and mods but I worry that people will convert to brushless and the 15 tooth pinion gear will no longer be made as is the case with several 1/18 models I have. Hopefully this craze will cause the manufacturers in China to produce a brushless version and available parts and we will have a path forward for longer term.....Right now I'm trying to figure out how to solder silver solder on an old pinion and modify a discontinued spur gear as well as make my own dogbones.

As such I think I will try out the HBX 16889 per your recommendation and maybe do the 144001 after more options are available....or just get it in brushed form until the motor dies.... Thanks for the interesting read!

16/9/2020 11:36:39 pm

Hmm that's a good point. Given the mounts for the 2838 on the stock mount they must have had plans some-point for a motor this size. My guess is they started with a 380/390 but abandoned it when they realised they could shoe-horn a 550 in. I might write to WL toys to see if they could comission a proper bolt on option in 2838 size. Personally I think the next effort should go into making an aftermarket spur fit as you say, then you'd have access to the more common 48 or 32 pitch gears which are cheap and plentiful

No harm in keeping the 144001 brushed, it's still a lot of fun but depletes the battery fast. The 16889 is just as fast though and the battery lasts forever. It's actually on special on my coupons page at present.

18/9/2020 05:24:20 am

Just finished the option 1 upgrade yesterday and the car runs great! It was a little tricky getting the hobbyking pinion mounted properly so that it would not rub against the motor mount but everything else was super easy. This setup is way better all around than when I was running the 3650 brushless setup.

18/9/2020 10:29:48 am

Awesome David that is good to hear. The 2838 is a very powerful motor. I genuinely believe this is a better option in 90% of cases for the 144001. The only way the 3650 is better is for speed runs which are frankly a little boring for me.

Augie Elbring

19/9/2020 07:46:18 pm

Hi Quadify! After reading all of your posts about the 144001, I decided to buy one as my first RC Car! I'm so excited to learn all about it. Do you know what exactly would happen if I were to use the stock gearing with the 2838 motor? If I were to keep the stock gearing, is there a brushless motor/esc that would be better suited? Thanks so much and keep up the amazing work.
Your fan,
Augie

19/9/2020 10:24:27 pm

Hey Augie

Nice! I'd encourage you to stick with brushed to get a feel for it before you jump into the upgrade. Check out my 2 articles on free and cheap upgrades to get it running right and protect the gear. If you still need more speed look at brushless. Back to your question no, there are no 2838 motors that have enough torque to do this. Changing gearing is a crucial part of the 2838 install.

20/9/2020 05:37:26 am

Thanks for the quick reply!! I am definitely gonna stick to the stock
motor for a while, I can’t really afford the brushless gear right now anyways! My car is being delivered later today, so I’ll try some of the free and cheap upgrades and let you know if I have any questions!

JAmes

22/9/2020 08:24:57 am

Hi thanks for all the hard work in compiliing this guide, my bits are on the way. FYI there is a youtube vid by someone called rcmodsquad where he shows how to remove the stock motor from the mount and the pinion set screw useing a heat gun and a vice. The heat softens the glue on the threads and allows the removal of them without damage.
Does the flysky reciever with gyro work fine with a gt2 transmitter? Just want to be sure before commiting to buy.

22/9/2020 10:35:01 pm

Yes it can absolutely be done. I've seen it done with a butane torch and have even done it myself with a cigarette lighter but the metal is so soft it is difficult for me to recommend when the replacement mounts are so cheap.

The lowest priced flysky transmitter that is able to control a flysky BS6 gyro receiver is the FS-GT5. Check out my review on it which I just finished a few days ago: https://www.quadifyrc.com/rccarreviews/flysky-fs-gt5-transmitter-review-and-setup

James

23/9/2020 05:10:45 am

Thank you

Rainer Schuster

22/9/2020 08:43:45 am

Hi,

today I've been test driving my 144001 on rocky ground and after 10 minutes I returned to the street with battery left. But it didn't drive any longer. Steering worked but not motor. After checking inside I discovered, that the power cabels to the motor overheated ... my best guess because of the rough underground and the increased draw of power. So one of the the transparent connector convers melted down and turned black almost completely. I could still remove it. Did you have any issues like this on the stock car or do you have an idea how to prevent this in the future?

Would you recommend doing something on the setup to prevent overheating of the wires?

Bests,
Rainer

22/9/2020 09:15:43 am

Hi Rainer

Sorry to hear about that. Rocky ground is usually ok because with traction down it limits the power draw but every situation can be different. Has it been fine on other surfaces? I can't think of any transparent connectors on this ESC but there may be variations. If any of there connectors are not fully plugged in there can be a large voltage drop, and the resistance can cause a lot of heat and melting as it sounds like you've had. Assuming this is the case first point would be to try replace the wire and connector that was damaged.

Cheers

maciek

23/10/2020 02:34:02 am

Hi,
I've read your posts about an upgrade to brushless. Tempted of some tinkering and clean nice setup with such small motor decided to go for it :)
Found same combo on tomtop (2838 4500kv + esc). Heh "same" :) on picture only. As it finally came to me I've noticed that esc looks different (sure its also 35A) but different body (looks like this one https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001031806584.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.f704686cU87Dp2&algo_pvid=eeb952c6-5531-43f8-a6ee-382f698ffb05&algo_expid=eeb952c6-5531-43f8-a6ee-382f698ffb05-13&btsid=0b0a050116033726614856494e0c44&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_ )
I've completed my setup and found problem with cogging (I believe thats the correct term). When lifted reacts and starts quite well but on the ground it has problems with take off. About 5 seconds with clunky sound and after it goes it runs quite ok I think. On grass it barely can start - often have to push it. Is it esc fault? I've ordered esc programming card - maybe I can set some settings to make it better. If not, can you guys suggest a better esc wich will fit and will have no problems?

23/10/2020 09:52:08 am

Unfortunately a lot of the others Chinese retailers bait and switch which is why I give direct links to Banggood who are at least fairly accurate. Cogging at low speed is a sign of either poor connection or a low quality ESC and or motor. Assuming the programming card works you could try increase timing but stock setting from the factory are usually the most reliable. Afraid I can't help on this one.

23/10/2020 07:52:54 pm

Thanks Quadify!
I'll check the card when it cames but I guess most probable the esc i got is just crap
Will this Racertstar 60A esc will be a good replacement? Will it be ok for the motor? (2838 4500kv)?

( https://www.banggood.com/Racerstar-60A-ESC-Brushless-Waterproof-Sensorless-1-or-10-RC-Car-Part-p-1085233.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CZ )

23/10/2020 11:20:50 pm

I'm just not familiar with that ESC sorry. I do have this Hobbywing ESC on a 4500kv 2838 motor in another car and know it is good https://bit.ly/34lfOFW Then again it is more expensive alone that the original combo I recommend from Banggood 🤷

26/10/2020 08:43:22 am

I think I will try this 16BL30 - looks promising :)
I noticed that there is a tamiya connector - will it be ok to use adapter for t-plug or just cut the tamiya connector from esc and solder iron the t-plug?

26/10/2020 10:27:20 pm

Definitely solder the t-plug on, much better connection

Jay

30/10/2020 12:36:14 am

Hey Quadify! Great article and info!

Looking at getting a 144001, and love RC cars so will probably jump straight to the brushless upgrade, I have 2 x 3 cell batteries already for an rc boat, so would like to use them, what gearing would you recommend for fun longevity? Have you been running any 3 cells on any of yours?

30/10/2020 08:57:31 am

Hi Jay

Thanks! Assuming the batteries physically fit that the setup in this article will suit you well - Will get you longevity in battery life and brushless motors also have a longer useful life.

If you are going straight to brushless check out this new article: https://www.quadifyrc.com/rccarreviews/brushless-upgrade-144001-vs-lc-racing-emb-mt-cost-and-performance-comparison

Dennis B.

1/11/2020 03:07:41 pm

Hi QUADIFYRC, you're site is a priceless resource. Well done! I'm wondering how the balance of the motor feels with the pinion + sleeve option? Reason I ask is, and correct me if I am wrong, the sleeve is fixed to the shaft with a grub screw and the pinion is fixed to the sleeve with a second grub screw. My thinking is if the grub screws are *not* 180 degrees out of phase then it may cause vibrations. It is probably a moot point, but interested in your thoughts. Cheers.

12/2/2021 10:37:13 am

Yikes completely missed your message! Thanks kindly for the feedback. It feels ok, the fit betweem shaft/pinion/sleeve is very good with no real wriggle so the force trying to make the pinion fit concentrically on the shaft is pretty small. For a racer you'd be looking to squeeze everything out but as a basher it is more than acceptable for me.

Luis cruz

13/11/2020 02:44:46 pm

Hello,

In your opinion, do you think this brushless setup will work on the new 124019 model? I’d like to know because I’m torn either buying the 14401 model or the new one.

13/11/2020 03:07:29 pm

Hi Luis

Absolutely it will work - all of the driveline is identical. You may wish to go for the longer 2845 motor but the 2838 is still perfectly capable in the 124018/19

Rcguy

21/11/2020 08:31:17 am

Hi which screw/bolt size do you use to mount the 2838 to the motor mount? It didn’t come with any screws.

23/11/2020 09:28:09 am

M2.5 but I cannot remember the length sorry, the stock ones are too short regardless. Choose a length that will allow the screw to go 2-3mm into the motor

23/11/2020 11:39:45 am

Took it to a nut and bolts shop. They measured and said it’s M 3.0. However, in trying to get the bolts through the holes in the mount, it got threaded, thus causing it to tighten only the mount instead of the engine to the mount. Solved it by drilling the holes with a 3.0 bit to clear the thread in the mount.

I’m on the 15T Pinion setup, with 3S. This thing absolutely flies with 3S. Just WOW. I thought of switching to a 17T Pinion for speed before trying out 3S. Changed my mind after watching what it can do with 3S On a 15T Pinion.

I am switching the longer body mounts to longer ones from the A959 For more clearance, 3S I have is a little thick.

23/11/2020 11:53:55 am

Oops sorry about the bum steer, sounds like you went down the right track anyway. I seems to remember drilling out the smaller holes in the motor mount to m3 as they would slightly too small which would explain why the threaded for you.

Moving on, I feel 15t with 2s is a little short but perfect for 3s! Glad you like it

Joseph

13/12/2020 06:04:24 pm

What 3s battery do you recommend?
Thanks

14/12/2020 09:06:37 am

This would be my recommendation - GNB tend to make the best cells https://bit.ly/37XYZBv

Sebastian

22/12/2020 04:34:05 am

Awesome guide - thank you for that.

Would this gear also work?

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32848991441.html

Looks like the same, which you mentioned. It's just a little bit cheaper.

Thanks!

Orzech

13/1/2021 12:23:45 am

Hi,
Thanks for a great tips and instructions.
My question is what do you think about the 15T pinion and 2838 or maybe 2845 motor with the higher KV eg. 5000KV to ride on 2s battery.

13/1/2021 10:26:01 am

My pleasure. On the 15t it would be fine to go with a little more kv. 17t worked will on 4500kv which would suggest around 5000kv on 15t makes sense. You'd be limited to 2s to be safe though (which is fine as these fit better)

16/1/2021 10:30:24 pm

Thanks for the advice. I will try mentioned configuration and give feedback.

Gareth S

13/1/2021 11:11:14 pm

Hi,
I can only agree with everyone else.
Thank you for a great comprehensive update guide.
There are so many Youtube vids but yours is the only one that has a complete guide and the reason why you do it that way.
And this web page is great with all the upgrade parts and links in one place also.
Keep on trucking
G

13/1/2021 11:19:16 pm

Cheers Gareth, appreciate the kind feedback. I enjoyed the way my car ran so much I'm glad that others get to share in the experience too. I always found pictures and text easier then videos too!

WRC

18/1/2021 09:20:15 pm

If I mostly run on grass and at 100F ambient temperature, would it be better to choose 3650 can with 2300KV or lower to keep the temp down? I could have the option to use 2S or 3S to optimize temperature? Granted I will be stuck with the stock 27t pinion.

19/1/2021 08:46:24 am

To be honest the smaller 2838 motor with 15t would run cooler but if you want to run 3650 I'd use around 3000kv with the stock pinion. You'll need a reasonable ESC to keep cogging down though

Alex

20/1/2021 10:20:40 pm

Hello,

First of all thank you for your great work and articles.

I consider to go brushless on my 124019 following your recommendations.
I can't decide among these options :
- 2838 - 4500kv motor + 17t pinion gear following your "ultimate brushless guide" ;
- 2838 - 4500kv motor + 15t pinion gear from this "easy no cut option";
- 3650 - 5200kv motor + stock 27t pinion gear from your "speed run build.

I prefer bashing. I understood the differences that you clearly explain in your guides but I would like to better know what top speed excpect from each option.
Do you have an idea of the top speeds reached with 3s and correct C-rating for each of these configurations (not exact top speed but like an idea compared to stock) ?

21/1/2021 10:14:50 am

Hi Alex

My pleasure. If you are planning on doing anything else other driving in a straight line on a very flat surface then skip the 3650 option.

I didn't get a chance to quantify speed before they were stolen but would recommend the 15t option with 2838 because it is easier to install. It is a little undergeared on 2s but is well suited to 3s. Depending on how hard you are pushing it on 3s, consider a stronger esc like the hobbywing 16bl30.

C rating on the battery shouldn't matter too much as these small brushless motors are very efficient. I found the stock 124019 battery to be good and it will fit the 144001 in the extended tray position.

21/1/2021 10:23:33 am

Hi again,

Thanks a lot for your advice. I will go with 2838 motor, 15t pinion and hobbywing 16bl30 esc.

Jester

11/2/2021 10:13:32 pm

What is the best kv rating for bashing 2838?

Carlos Roque link

26/1/2021 06:31:25 am

the huby surpass has a pinion manufactured by them with an inner diameter of 3.175mm with 15t ... the designation on AliExpress is -SURPASS HOBBY 1pcs 48DP 3.175mm 13T-41T Metal Pinion Motor Gear for 1/10 RC Car..
do you think this product works directly on the 2838 or 2845 engine and in the car without modifications? thanks

Carlos Roque

26/1/2021 12:32:52 pm

Hi
First, I would like to say what I did not say a little while ago, that is to thank the work and effort applied in this site more specifically in relation to the models 144001 and 124019. As for my question a little while ago, correct me if i´m
wrong... The pinion of the model A959 15T (which is indicated in the article) has 11.8 mm in diameter and the Surpass Hobby has 9.01 mm in diameter so it will not work.
With the 2838 engine I need a pinion with 11.8 mm in diameter and 9.5 mm in depth and with a center of 3.17 mm in diameter, right? This is my question

26/1/2021 03:16:12 pm

One last question.
What do you have to say about the adjustable motor support from LC Racing - L6027 MOTOR MOUNT
Thank you very much

27/1/2021 01:32:11 pm

Hi

I will apologize in advance for having written 3 replies above without asking any specific questions. Because the information is a lot and I am very confused. Feel free to delete them if you please.
After reading the article carefully, I came to the conclusion that changing the pinion 15T 0.7 mod from Wltoys is the right one for me.

Moving on (For 15T pinion)

It is said in the comments that for the 2838 motor 4500 kv a 2s battery is short but for 3s it is perfect.

It is also said that for the 2838 motor 5000kv (which does not exist ..) there is 4700kv or 5300kv 2s battery is perfect.

This for the model 144001 ...

I have model 124019 and for this model the 2845 motor was suggested.

There are three 2845 models on the Surpass hobby website.

2845 blue indicates stator with 0.35mm laminations
2845 red model is the same as blue but waterproof
2845 platinum indicates stator with 0.2mm laminations

1st question

Which of these three engines do you recommend, the specifications being exactly the same for the three models except for what I mentioned above.

2nd question

Which Kv´s do you recommend for model 124019 with pinion 15T for 2s battery and which kv´s are recommended for 3s battery? (on the website there is this 2845 engine with options 3100kv; 3800kv; 3930kv; 4370kv; 5000kv and 5900kv)

I hope I made myself understood and thank you very much for the article and information.

28/1/2021 11:49:59 pm

Hi there

The 2838 motor at 4500kv is still my recommended solution. If you go higher in kV it tends to overheat. 15t is a nice reliable gear and I'd start with that. If you wan't more top end later on you can always mod the motor mount to go to 17t. I've been trying other size and kv options but still recommend this setup as best.

Zombie2Monster

29/1/2021 04:06:09 am

can i run with this https://www.banggood.com/Racerstar-2440-Motor-Brushless-Waterproof-Sensorless-6080-or-4600-or-4000KV-1-or-18-1-or-16-RC-Car-Part-p-1112737.html?akmClientCountry=PL&cur_warehouse=CN&ID=514253

(4600 kv)

and

https://www.banggood.com/Racerstar-35A-ESC-Brushless-Waterproof-114-116-118-RC-Car-Part-p-1082604.html?cur_warehouse=CN&rmmds=detail-top-buytogether-auto

on lipo 3s battery if not can i use an 6000 kv version?

29/1/2021 10:28:54 pm

I'd recommend against the 2440, it's just not big enough. I'm currently testing a 2445 which is barely large enough - runs hot and is very battery hungry so far.

Jens Sauer

9/2/2021 10:58:43 am

Hi,

like to go for the 2838 - 4500kv motor + 15t pinion gear from this "easy no cut option" with my 124019 but found hat cheap option - ist it worth the money? will it fit hassle free?

https://de.aliexpress.com/item/1005002063270696.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.7b543c00pd4P9I&mp=1

Thanks for the advice and keep up the great work!

Greetings from Switzerland - Jens

9/2/2021 11:45:05 am

Hi Jens, thanks for the feedback and love your beautiful country. I'd strongly recommend getting the one linked. I've seen failures on other units and can at least put my name to the one I used here. Not only that but it can be hit and miss about which vendors on Ali are good and which are not. Banggood is just one vendor at least.

Jens Sauer link

11/2/2021 02:13:00 am

Hi,

just stumpled about this pinion isn`t that working?
https://de.aliexpress.com/item/4001242577882.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.270b402fO34yrW&algo_pvid=2dda2fb8-eb21-43b9-b770-511d32388a59&algo_expid=2dda2fb8-eb21-43b9-b770-511d32388a59-2&btsid=0bb0623116129618628154921e8ea4&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

Regards, Jens

11/2/2021 12:15:22 pm

Hi Jens

Only the pinions I've linked work. They are extremely rare and uncommon. There are so many different pitches and muduli available it is confusing. Please just use the ones I've linked.

14/3/2021 08:03:16 am

Hey Quadrify, great article thank you! I've seen your later article with the 2445 drop in route - which would you recommend most now? I've already bought the 2838 combo but could just order the 2445 motor if that's a better option? How do speed and acceleration compare, is there a significant difference? Would a faster 2838 (5100kV) be suitable as a quicker option?

15/3/2021 10:33:42 am

Hi James

Thanks for that! Honestly I find the 2838 4500kv the best, most balanced setup but it is a bit of work, especially if you haven't done this sort of think before. I do recommend the 2445 only because it is so much easier. In terms of 2838 I like 4500kv best, 5100kv will give you more speed but more heat / less battery life.

15/3/2021 10:42:38 am

Thank you - I appreciate your feedback! I should have confirmed I'm looking at the easy no cut option with the 15t pinion in a 124019. I might go for the 5100kV 2838 w/15t to aim for a similar top speed as the 2445 suggested build, but am tempted by the 5700kV 2838 option too - is that viable with the 15T pinion?

15/3/2021 01:18:22 pm

Hey James, my pleasure.

Personally efficiency is at the top of my list where I feel the 4500kv hits the sweet spot. 5400kv is the best available option for the 2445 and is definitely faster but also takes more power and makes more heat. 5100kv 2838 with 15t pinion is exactly equivalent to 4500kv with 17t (which I love) so sounds good to me. 5700kv a bit too high IMO

16/3/2021 12:15:02 am

Brilliant, thanks Quadrify - that confirms my understanding! I've ordered the 5100kV motor :)

26/3/2021 10:33:51 am

Excellent, have fun James!

Luke

1/9/2021 08:00:48 am

Hi James,

I'm looking at doing the same build as you 2838 5100kv with 15t but in a 144001. How has this set up been for you, any problems? Does the high amp draw cause it to over heat?

Mick Lee

23/5/2021 08:59:06 am

Do you need to upgrade the steering servo? Why?

23/5/2021 09:41:07 pm

The stock servo is a 5 wire unit and not compatible with any aftermarket receivers such are used here. You will need a 3 wire servo in the correct size as listed here.

Joeke

18/6/2021 12:25:08 am

Hi! First of all, thank you for all your great articles and info, this website really is a goldmine with useful information.
I have owned a 144001 for about 2 months now, and looking to upgrade to brushless, mainly for more runtime on the stock 2s batteries, but also less overheating, and ofcourse also for some more speed :).
You mentioned that with the 2838 / with 15t it is a bit "undergeared" . What does this mean? Less torque or maybe less acceleration from standstil? Or is it less top speed?

18/6/2021 03:50:13 pm

Hi Joeke, my pleasure! Yes undergeared = more torque and less top speed however it is still faster than stock and gives you massive runtime, roughly double compared to stock.

Dan

9/7/2021 10:59:29 am

Hi, So I have my 144001 on order which should arrive tomorrow and have already ordered the parts needed for the 17t brushless upgrade, however since ordering the parts I have found this 15t option which seems like the option I should and would prefer but can not find the 15t pinion gear anywhere that will ship to me here in the UK. Is this something you maybe able to help out with?

Thanks in advance and keep up with the good work

16/7/2021 03:34:19 pm

Hi Dan, you should be able to get it? try these links:
https://bit.ly/30zzNhg
https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_9jYFmG

Mark

15/7/2021 03:08:41 pm

Hey mate, I see people are getting about 50kph with the 2838 4500kv and 15t pinion. Would this setup have much more torque/acceleration than stock. I’m looking at using the hobbywing 30a esc. Also could this setup run on 3s and how quick do you think it would be?
Cheers

16/7/2021 03:32:24 pm

Hi Mark. Way more acceleration, torque and about double the battery life. It feels much faster because of this too. Sadly my car was stolen before I could GPS test it but I'm certain it was noticably faster than stock. I wouldn't run this on 3s with this ESC, google the drop in brushless upgrade if you want more speed than this.

3/9/2021 09:45:25 pm

Hi quadifyrc! I want to make my 124019 a good bashing machine. Im not into speed builds and i dont need It to be faster, just more efficient and cooler. Can i put a 3560 3100kv motor with the 17t pinion and keep It cool and ¿Will the battery last longer? Can you advise me on a 3650 motor for offroad? Dont need It to be crazy fast. I have a adjustable 3560 motor mount to move the motor the way i need, si the pinion option is no problem. What do you think Will fit in better? Pretending to use 76/80mm diámeter wheels.

3/9/2021 10:26:10 pm

For bashing I recommend a smaller motor as the big 3650 is heavy and upsets the weight balance. The easiest install is the 2445 3600kv as per my drop in brushless upgrade. This is a very good reliable setup https://www.quadifyrc.com/rccarreviews/drop-in-brushless-upgrade-guide-for-wl-toys-144001-124018-and-124019-quadifyrc

13/9/2021 08:43:04 pm

Ok, ill forget about the 3650 motor.
Ill be using the 15t pinion. What build do you recomend me?( the 2445 3600kv or the 2838/2840 3800kv?) Both following your tutorials. And with the 10bl120 quickrun. Mostly mixed on/offroad with 80mm wheels, short grass and gravel.

13/9/2021 10:27:21 pm

I'd go with the 2445 3600kv. However if you are a very confident builder then consider the 2838 which has a little more torque

14/9/2021 06:26:30 am

thanks a lot! You are the best, like your guides!

15/9/2021 09:41:48 pm

One last question, i promise. Im a confident builder and ill buy the 2845 3800kv motor paired with the Big 10bl120. Will i be able to use this?
€ 10,53 33%de DESCUENTO | 2021 2 unids/set 1/12 caucho neumático para coches de carreras de neumáticos y de plástico rueda con buje llantas para 1:12 RC coche de carreras de coche RC piezas de neumáticos de rueda de
https://a.aliexpress.com/_vef7XG
Theyre 90mm diametre. If the answer is no, why? Where will the weak spot be? Thank a lot.

16/9/2021 05:09:04 pm

90mm is getting a bit big. Even on the 15t your motor will get a bit hot in 2s. I'd recommend these instead: https://bit.ly/3m9TlkU

David Cappotto

30/10/2021 03:09:24 am

@QuadiftRC, will this pinion work with 2838 motor now that the hobbywing 15t options are sold out. I know I would need a reducing sleeve for the shaft, just wondering about pinion dimensions and tooth count if it will be too small. Thank you!

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/hobbykingtm-0-7m-hardened-steel-helicopter-pinion-gear-5mm-shaft-14t.html?wrh_pdp=2&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=google_us_shopping&countrycode=US

30/10/2021 11:42:23 pm

Hi David. It will mesh but getting the pinion to fit in the mount with the wider collar is a pain let alone the fact that you would need to slow the motor mount because the 14t is smaller. I'd recommend getting the 15t from ali express and drilling out if you want to stick with 2838 or consider this option where no drilling is needed https://www.quadifyrc.com/rccarreviews/drop-in-brushless-upgrade-guide-for-wl-toys-144001-124018-and-124019-quadifyrc

31/10/2021 01:57:37 am

Oh really good to know, thanks for getting this info back to me. I didn't know about your new drop in method, I will definitely go that route.

Thanks!

Nicolás Claverie

14/1/2022 02:03:03 pm

@QuadiftR, hi, i am trying fot the no drill option with the 15t pinion,
this part will work??
https://es.aliexpress.com/item/1005003113254727.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.282d3c00eoOYay&mp=1

and for the servo, this will fit on the 144001??
https://es.aliexpress.com/item/1005002345077947.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.282d3c00eoOYay&mp=1 (17g servo)

OLderDan

15/1/2022 01:27:40 pm

Anyone trying the 15 tooth pinion no drilling required from Ali express, be warned that the quality is terrible. After one session on the stock plastic spur it wore the pinion teeth down to unusable. They were available in two metal types, but I think I will just drill out the other option after waiting 15 days for a pinion that didn't last 1hour.

16/1/2022 01:15:31 am

Note that this was the copper version.

16/1/2022 03:03:37 am

i will try with the steel option, hope is better than the copper alternative

Mike S

24/1/2022 12:20:14 am

Hi Quadify RC,

I have used your Brushless motor upgrade Option 2 with the 2838 4500kv motor, and 15T pinion, and initial impressions are very positive, thank you, so I wondered if you would like some additional feedback?

Just as you suggested, the top speed of my 144001 is a now bit higher, the acceleration is substantially better, and battery life is also noticeably longer. I went with the Flysky FS-GT2E transmitter/receiver combo, and find that the operation range is significantly further.

Once again, thank you for your exceptional advice.

24/1/2022 12:22:14 am

I have seen some slight cogging at times, and the initial takeoff is slightly delayed from the throttle opening. The worst situation is when trying to go forwards when the car is rolling backwards slightly: it doesn't respond very well to the throttle, although it improves with more throttle opening. One thing that the brushless motor was always good at was its instantaneous throttle response, so I do miss that with this brushless setup. Have you tried a sensored motor setup?

24/1/2022 12:23:41 am

With the 15T pinion on the original motor mount bracket, the gear mesh with an upgraded metal spur gear is on the loose side, so that was a surprise, given that yours was tight. It creates a bit more noise that the original. I'll keep an eye on teeth wear, to determine if I need to adjust it.

24/1/2022 12:27:59 am

An unexpected bonus is that the steering servo that you recommend works much better than the original. It has more torque to ensure that full steering lock can always be achieved. The car originally would not turn sharply at speed, making me think that a handling issue had the car understeering, requiring the throttle to be reduced to help the car turn. This new servo shows that actually the original servo was not strong enough to maintain steering lock against the steering self-centering forces under high throttle loads at high speeds. Now the car can turn so sharply that it can get up on two wheels, or roll over, so it has to be driven more carefully. This is with LC Racing anti-sway bars fitted too.

Note that I also had dialled back the new transmitter's ST.DR control from the initial 100% position because the servo was attempting to turn the steering beyond full lock, resulting in flexing of the servo's mounting clamp in reaction to the force applied by the servo.

MIKE S

27/1/2022 10:30:49 pm

Hi Quadifyrc,

1. Have you found any differences between the 15T pinion gears from the two suppliers you have links to for your build Option 2?
I went with your alternative link:
https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_9jYFmG

As I mentioned on 24/01/2022, that with Option 2 with the 2838 4500kv motor, the pinion to spur gear backlash is high, and now the spur gear teeth have stripped off, damaging the metal upgrade spur gear on the centre driveshaft, and metal fragments from the stripped gear have gone into the brand new 2838 motor's front bearing, destroying the bearing. This occurred after no more than 2 hours runtime since build. Fortunately, I have been able to buy a replacement motor bearing locally.

2. I am reluctant to repeat the same build though, for fear of the same failure occurring, so should I try this 15T?
https://bit.ly/30zzNhg

3. or convert to a 17T pinion?

In either case, I will modify the motor mount to optimise the gear meshing.

Thanks

27/1/2022 10:47:31 pm

Hi Quadifyrc,

From your experience, is the original 144001 plastic spur gear on the centre driveshaft adequate for your brushless upgrades, durability-wise?

I ask this because I am trying to understand the reasons for the pinion failure (see my post above) on my brushless upgrade build, and I noticed that all your upgrade guide photos show the original spur gear, whereas my car has a WLToys upgrade centre driveshaft assembly with a metal spur gear.

Thanks

18/2/2022 07:55:43 pm

Does anyone know if this is the same, or is compatible?
https://www.wltoysrc.com/home/3284-wltoys-l303-rc-car-parts-15t-motor-gear-p949-26.html
It appears to be the same for WLToys L313 and L323 as well.

12/4/2022 12:32:52 pm

They might fit but all I can say for certain is that the only confirmed fit I am aware of is the 15t I linked in the article

john doug

19/3/2022 05:17:48 pm

so if i was to have found a motor mount with slots instead of holes(for mesh adjustment) could i use any tooth pinion i wanted. also if i was to change the drive shaft gear to a mod 1, would that solve most of the main issues that arise with switching to brushless?

12/4/2022 12:31:50 pm

Yes, but the only motor mounts that are slotted fit the 3650 which is fine for speed runs but not general bashing where the smaller motors are better. Moving to mod 1 creates other issues particularly around the lack of hanger bearings.

José Sampaio

27/3/2022 11:55:07 pm

Is there a replacement main gear with a "standard" pitch?

12/4/2022 12:30:21 pm

Spur gear? Unfortunately no

Ian B

5/4/2022 09:40:51 pm

Just been on Aliexpress to order some 17T gears for this upgrade and noticed that the motor mount and 19T pinion are on sale from the 124016 & 17 v2. I guess this too would be a 'no cut' upgrade and the pinion probably won't require drilling out.

13/4/2022 09:11:29 am

Yep that would work. Personally I'd pair the 19t with 3400kv but would still prefer higher kv on 15t

QUADIFYRC RC Car Review and Upgrade Guides

WL TOys 144001 / 124018 / 124019 Brushless 2838 upgrade Easy No cut option

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